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 Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania

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fronkhead
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Rum
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyThu 1 Nov 2018 - 22:27

I lost over 900 Geo again, but the internet recommended killing myself before finding a bench and getting stuck there, so I just sacrificed it. (Again.) The internet also keeps saying "Geo starts being something you have loads of!" but 7 or so hours into the game having found myself losing that much cash twice over, my instinctive reaction is "that's all well and good, but it sure would be nice to have that 1800+ Geo right about now to get the upgrades to actually get further in the game"... I only ended up in Deepnest because a floor collapsed underneath me while I was exploring a much easier area, which was a bit of a pain in the nips.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyThu 1 Nov 2018 - 22:28

The Internet is indeed right, though. As you progress through the game, the enemies start dropping more and more Geo, so it won't take long to accumulate a big ol' pile of Geo. You'll also be able to sell some of the collectables you've likely picked up too which translates into big bucks.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyThu 1 Nov 2018 - 22:48

I don't doubt that - but that doesn't stop it from being a colossal pain in the arse and - dare I say it - not very fun when you're in the early stages. I was having a great time exploring, learning enemies' attack patterns, scoping out benches and working out how to manoeuvre around - only to end up falling into an area (literally) where I couldn't retrace my steps to get out. And I don't see that I could have predicted it because I had walked over that floor before, and it was only when I was walking back that it broke. And I couldn't survive. And all the received wisdom was "just let the game beat you". It leaves a sour taste when you're enjoying it the vast majority of the time.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyThu 1 Nov 2018 - 23:41

I guess that's a trapping of having that mechanic ripped out of the Souls series. It smarts there, but I suppose it gives death a real consequence unlike most games, which is somewhat refreshing in this day and age, albeit something you've got to be prepared for going into a game.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptySat 3 Nov 2018 - 8:23

Something similar happened to me, but against all the odds I managed to find a way back up and out without dying. Quite chuffed with that, I was!
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OrangeRakoon
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyTue 6 Nov 2018 - 13:21

You can always unlock the door in Dirtmouth and return there to get your geo back, rather than having to go back to where you died
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyThu 16 Jul 2020 - 13:33

OrangeRakoon wrote:
You can always unlock the door in Dirtmouth and return there to get your geo back, rather than having to go back to where you died

Only 20 months later and I have done just that!

Reading back on my posts from then I can see where I was coming from, but trying to have the patience to persist this time around Laughing Just had my arse handed to me by the Soul Master so went and got a couple of new charms from Salubra and will have a go at investigating some other potential areas to see if there's any progress I can make before he hands me my arse again.

I'm not an especially patient gamer but hopefully I can plough my way through a bit more of Hallownest!
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyThu 16 Jul 2020 - 20:04

The Soul Master was the worst part of the game for me - best of luck Rum! It gets better thereafter.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptySat 18 Jul 2020 - 13:44

I'm definitely someone who will drop a game easily if it's not going my way but I never felt that way about Hollow Knight,I always felt that if I was struggling it was down to my decision making rather than the game being too difficult. I'd say it's worth sticking with because once you figure out how to do a battle it's so rewarding.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptySat 18 Jul 2020 - 15:19

The game's definitely a hard one, but it does a great job of making each fight feel fair. What drove me to persevere with the trickier fights was feeling myself improve on each run and I think it's important to have that feeling present as smashing yourself against a brick wall for hours isn't fun... looking at you Path of Pain.

(still beat it though because I rule)
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptySun 19 Jul 2020 - 15:43

Treesmurf wrote:
I'm definitely someone who will drop a game easily if it's not going my way but I never felt that way about Hollow Knight,I always felt that if I was struggling it was down to my decision making rather than the game being too difficult.

For the most part I'd agree with the above - the path to the Soul Master was an exception (also the Watcher Knights).
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyMon 20 Jul 2020 - 17:17

I'm getting along with it much, much better now. I think it might be particularly tough to start with as you're so weak, but after unlocking a bunch of different notches, charms, spells, and moves, I'm finding it a lot more fun - albeit still challenging! I went back to Soul Master and actually defeated him on my second try, but then found a boss in the Ancient Basin that I struggled with more than I felt I should have (his moves were predictable, I just have slow fingers sometimes).

Also, Deepnest is properly spooky. All those creepy skittering noises? Gross. I hoped we might see a bit of Silksong in today's Direct Mini, but it'll have to wait another day.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyWed 22 Jul 2020 - 11:49

Balladeer wrote:
(also the Watcher Knights).  

I managed to find a combination of charms which made that fight manageable (I really don't know how I would have done it without it): Grubsong (refill SOUL when attacked), Quick Focus (to regen health quickly), Spore Shroom (to create damaging puffs of spores when you regen), and Sharp Shadow (damage enemies when dashing through them), while occasionally landing a couple of hits with the nail. It left me with enough time to dash around to injure them, occasionally getting hit to give me the SOUL I needed to focus my health to create spore puffs to injure them, and every once in a while I'd manage to slash at them too. I was really satisfied with that solution as it meant I beat them on my 3rd try.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyWed 22 Jul 2020 - 19:01

Blimey, that's good going. I'm not sure I found time to regen all fight, even with QF equipped.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyWed 9 Nov 2022 - 11:24

I decided to boot this game up over the weekend. I can't remember how far through it I got in the past, but I don't think I finished it. I certainly don't remember the exploding Jellyfish in the fog area for example.

I'm not really sure how far through the game I am. I've just beaten the Mantis Guardians, upgraded the nail, and beaten some arcane lad in the capital region. But I feel like I have got further through it than I have previously... I've just unlocked the ability to smash weak floors, although I might have unlocked that before. Maybe it's just beating the Mantis Guardians that's new to me! I don't think I ever upgraded the nail in my last go...

Oftentimes when I enter a new area, I feel like the stag coach fella - old memories start coming back Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyWed 9 Nov 2022 - 12:00

Mantis Guardians I seem to recall being a lot of people's first wall. They're probably equivalent to like a Gargoyles or a Quelaag.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyWed 9 Nov 2022 - 22:10

I didn't find the Mantis Guardians as big a step up as some. Probably due to a relatively short trip back after death and a belting soundtrack. I thought they were fun! And I love how they bow to you afterwards.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptySat 12 Nov 2022 - 12:33

I think the main reason I stopped playing is probably the same reason I've put it down for a few days now: I just don't really like feeling a directionless. I'm not finding the game difficult in terms of dying. I've died a handful of times to a few different bosses as you'd expect. It's more the traipsing back and forth that's lost its lustre.

I feel like the sense of tempo in the discovery has become much less appealing as the game has worn on.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyMon 14 Nov 2022 - 21:33

I definitely used a guide more to find my way around the game than I did to help me with e.g. the bosses and them. No shame in that!
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyWed 16 Nov 2022 - 13:25

Muss wrote:

I feel like the sense of tempo in the discovery has become much less appealing as the game has worn on.

Ah, I still enjoyed the sense of discovery the game gave me even in the latter half of the journey. I found discovering some of the secret areas to be a real treat. Well, except for the bullshit super secret area hidden behind a wall with no indication it could be broken. Laughing

I didn't mind the backtracking either - the game's map system is quite fair in that regard in that it lets you pop pins onto locations you can't yet explore, which is more than most classics in the genre allow.
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PostSubject: Re: Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania   Hollow Knight - A Bugger of a Metroidvania - Page 8 EmptyFri 18 Nov 2022 - 8:10

It seems very relative what games are fun to explore and what aren't. For example, I really enjoyed exploring Hollownest, but after everyone said Metroid Dread held your hand too much, I actually got lost repeatedly.
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