Paper Mario and the Thousand-Year-Awaited Remaster

I'm not a big fan of remasters... except recently on Switch we've had Metroid Prime, Ghost Trick, and now this. Nintendo (and Capcom) doing an absolute nonsense of a job bringing the games I most loved back to life.

Anyway, this looks exactly how I remember it looking, which is to say probably much much nicer than it actually looks these days - and of course you can't actually get it these days for love nor (a reasonable amount of) money. Is it the bombshell of a new game that should have been ending a full-length Nintendo Direct? Mmm. Is it an absolute must-have for anybody who hasn't played it yet, or anybody who doesn't remember it very well and has the money to spare? Absolutely hecking yes.

I've never played SMRPG, the original Paper Mario or TTYD, and soon I'll have access to all three on Switch.

I'd like to know more about the Trans stuff that was dropped from the English translation. Is it prudish America avoiding LGBTQ+ mentions, or severely out-of-date Japan writing an offensive joke character whose punchline is "they are trans" and Englih translators smartly avoiding it? In a brief google, I heard arguments for both, though there were several places applauding it for representation, so I assume it isn't entirely heinous.

As said elsewhere on the forum I'm ohh look it's a remake of a game that I've already played and own but then TTYD (like most of the Cube library) is a banger that I get to play again along with the likes of Luke get to play for the first time.

Buskalilly wrote:

I'd like to know more about the Trans stuff that was dropped from the English translation. Is it prudish America avoiding LGBTQ+ mentions, or severely out-of-date Japan writing an offensive joke character whose punchline is "they are trans" and Englih translators smartly avoiding it? In a brief google, I heard arguments for both, though there were several places applauding it for representation, so I assume it isn't entirely heinous.

MarioWiki wrote:

In the original Japanese version of the game and some translations, Vivian is inconsistently depicted as either a transgender woman, or as a male-identifying cross-dresser; however, due to the age rating the localizers were aiming at when translating Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door, this is lost in the English version, and she is described only with feminine pronouns.

...However, in Super Paper Mario, Vivian's Catch Card describes her using the term otoko no ko,[7] a Japanese-language term that can interchangeably refer to a feminine-presenting man or a crossdressing man, rather than "transgender" (which is identical in Japanese to the English-language word) or okama (a term for an otherwise masculine man who dresses as a woman, sometimes used as a slur to refer to trans women, even in family-friendly media at the time).

In TTYD itself, my understanding is that the villains call Vivian male until the end of the game, where they accept her as female.  I think that's pretty decent, not only for the culture and the time but for now, especially in the Decadent West.

Quote :

Vivian is inconsistently depicted as either a transgender woman, or as a male-identifying cross-dresser

If this is just the villain, that's one thing, if the game's writing conflates the too generally, ooh-err.]
Either way, it sounds like NoA's decision was made in bad faith.

Yep regardless of how wrong the original Japanese got it, the translation could easily have corrected the references to make her a consistent trans woman, rather than getting rid of that entirely under the pretext that It'S fOr ThE cHiLdReN.

Game's still belting though.

Excited to replay this (though I don't think I ever fully finished it?) much like I was for the Ghost Trick remaster, I just hope it isn't out in the first few months of 2024 as that feels a little bit too close to Super Mario RPG to me.

Balladeer wrote:

 Is it the bombshell of a new game that should have been ending a full-length Nintendo Direct?  Mmm.  Is it an absolute must-have for anybody who hasn't played it yet, or anybody who doesn't remember it very well and has the money to spare?  Absolutely hecking yes.

I’m part of that ‘doesn’t remember it well’ group. Or at least I hope I don’t: the main thing I recall about it was that there was too much dialogue in the opening few hours. It just didn't shut the fuck up. I didn’t get any further than that back when, but assuming this remaster releases at a time when the focus is turning towards the Switch’s successor and doesn’t overlap with much else then I’ll likely give it a fair(er) crack.

I mean. It's a JRPG. There is a lot of talking. The question is whether the dialogue's any good or not, and I remember it being pretty excellent throughout with maybe a minor blip when it gets to the tree. The whole game goes through a blip when it gets to the tree.

The Cappuccino Kid wrote:

Balladeer wrote:

 Is it the bombshell of a new game that should have been ending a full-length Nintendo Direct?  Mmm.  Is it an absolute must-have for anybody who hasn't played it yet, or anybody who doesn't remember it very well and has the money to spare?  Absolutely hecking yes.

I’m part of that ‘doesn’t remember it well’ group. Or at least I hope I don’t: the main thing I recall about it was that there was too much dialogue in the opening few hours. It just didn't shut the fuck up. I didn’t get any further than that back when, but assuming this remaster releases at a time when the focus is turning towards the Switch’s successor and doesn’t overlap with much else then I’ll likely give it a fair(er) crack.

Not sure if it'll have been spoilt for you by now or if you got that far the first time but I'm willing to bet you'll get a kick out of the third area of the game.

Treesmurf wrote:

Not sure if it'll have been spoilt for you by now or if you got that far the first time but I'm willing to bet you'll get a kick out of the third area of the game.

Nah, other than it’s reputation I don’t really know much about this Paper Mario.

~

I’ve said about giving it a fair crack but, I don’t know, I think I’ve done all right with these games. I completed the N64 Paper Mario on the Virtual Console and I thought it was brilliant. I bought Super Paper Mario on the day it released but I had one of those glitched copies that ruined your game after about three hours, I never returned to it. Sticker Star, the Wii U one (forgot it’s name!) and The Origami King just did too many weird things that soon put me off of playing them to the finish. I’m not sure, but if The Thousand Year Door was so highly regarded then I think I’d probably not bother with it and say I was done with the Paper Mario games.

As I understand it, this one and the N64 one are of a piece - its after this one they constantly mess with the formula and create the weirdness.

I haven't played this or the N64 one, but I loved Super, skipped the Wii U one, didn't get on super well with the 3DS one and then forced myself through Origami King's crap combat because I was enjoying the adventure. I'm hopeful that the trilogy of SMRPG, PM and PMTTYD won't disappoint me in the coming months.

Oh yeah, absolutely don't base what you think you know about TTYD on any of the games that came after it. TTYD is my second favourite game of all time, but I can't stand Sticker Star and I presume would feel similar about Colour Splash, which looks like more of the same. Even Super Paper Mario, which I remember fondly, is a completely different kettle of fish.

TTYD really is Paper Mario 2, going down the bigger better more approach. That includes the weird writing, whimsical variants on existing Mario characters, emphasis on turn-based but action-influenced battles from its predecessor, and actual but very light RPG mechanics. If you thought Paper Mario was brilliant Cappa, I can't see why you wouldn't think the same about TTYD unless you thought the recipe only supported the one game.

I remember reading reviews about TTYD where the main criticism of it was too much waffling and being baffled because I loved that about it - I thought it was charming. I am really excited about this. It was my favourite Gamecube game along with Tales of Symphonia, but unlike ToS, I reckon they won't totally muff up the remaster.

Rum wrote:

I remember reading reviews about TTYD where the main criticism of it was too much waffling and being baffled because I loved that about it - I thought it was charming.

100% agreed - I hate turn-based shenanigans, but the story of TTYD kept me wanting to see more.

Rum wrote:

I remember reading reviews about TTYD where the main criticism of it was too much waffling

"too many words"

It's almost like, if writing is good then you want lots and if it's bad, you want less. Someone should look into this.

Sounds fake.

...I'd use Fifty Shades or something as a counterexample but it feels like very low-hanging fruit these days.

Totally unrelated to TTYD, but there's a bar in Edinburgh that has wallpapered the men's bathroom with pages from Fifty Shades of Grey, so make of that what you will.

I have serious issues with Fifty Shades as many peoples' introduction to BDSM, but as a fantasy it clearly got a lot of people off, so its doing something right.

Yep all my BDSM friends hate Fifty Shades, and not just as a miserable example of the written word.

JayMoyles wrote:

Totally unrelated to TTYD, but there's a bar in Edinburgh that has wallpapered the men's bathroom with pages from Fifty Shades of Grey, so make of that what you will.

Is there? Which bar is that?

Also: how dare you turn a thread about an iconic Gamecube game into a thread about 50 Shades in the toilet.

Balladeer wrote:

Yep all my BDSM friends hate Fifty Shades, and not just as a miserable example of the written word.  

Surely someone who says "All my BDSM friends" is likely a BDSM friend to someone else? Balla you little minx.

Rum wrote:

JayMoyles wrote:

Totally unrelated to TTYD, but there's a bar in Edinburgh that has wallpapered the men's bathroom with pages from Fifty Shades of Grey, so make of that what you will.

Is there? Which bar is that?

Also: how dare you turn a thread about an iconic Gamecube game into a thread about 50 Shades in the toilet.

It's what Mario would want.

And Hoot the Redeemer on Hanover Street. It's decorated to look like an old fairground, like the one that Tom Hanks gets a fortune telling from in Big.

It's short for Bowser Daisy Super Mario actually.

Treesmurf wrote:

Balladeer wrote:

Yep all my BDSM friends hate Fifty Shades, and not just as a miserable example of the written word.  

Surely someone who says "All my BDSM friends" is likely a BDSM friend to someone else? Balla you little minx.

Lapsed Catholic Smurf, far too awkward and guilty on that front to be a BDSM friend. And it's not like Catholicism is big into power or punishment dynamics.