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 New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)

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Buskalilly
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PostSubject: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyMon 13 Nov 2023 - 20:05

New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) Maxresdefault

Buskalilly wrote:
...I don't like the way the whole world has been talking like the NSMB games weren't tight, fun games. They felt a little samey, sure, but they were all excellent at what they did.

This got me thinking.  Buska's right, that the narrative on the New Super Mario Bros. games has turned to be pretty negative on the whole.  Now that we've got our brand spanking new super-imaginative 2D Mario, is there room for a bit more sympathy towards the older, arguably more formulaic, games?  

Let's find out!  Each week I think it might be fun to talk about an NSMB game, and read other forumites' experiences with them.  My experiences weren't great at any point so I'll probably be pretty quiet until the final week (which yes will be in December, shhhhh), but I look forward to seeing what you folks come up with!  Hopefully this gets some good discussion and isn't just Buska reposting his 35-second videos (although he can do that as well if he likes).


~  ~  ~

New Super Mario Bros. (DS, 2006)

New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) SI_NDS_NewSuperMarioBrosDS_image1600w

So everyone apart from me thought this was pretty good, right?  The first 2D Mario for more than a decade, it introduced the show-stopping Mega Mushroom and trampling down everything in your path, as well as the Mini Mushroom and the Blue Koopa Shell (we don't talk about that one).  It had secret exits, it had different and interesting bosses, it had the 'bah! Bah!' musical riff and 3D-2D style while those were both new and cool.  It was pretty traditional in style, but after ten years away we were fine with that, weren't we?  We were, and I have proof!  (Just, er, ignore my post further down the page. Shifty )  

What are your memories of the game that kicked it all off?  Inquiring minds need to know!


Last edited by Balladeer on Mon 4 Dec 2023 - 20:39; edited 3 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyMon 13 Nov 2023 - 22:53

This is actually the only one of the NSMB games I never owned, so I'm gonna be completely useless here but I did play a bit of it as a friend owned it, I remember enjoying it but not being wowed enough to go and buy it.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyWed 15 Nov 2023 - 7:33



I did like this game. It plays nicely, has a really pleasant difficulty curve and came with those minigames. It was well made, it looked and sounded pleasant if inoffensive. I enjoyed it enough that I 100%ed all three save files, but also I had a lot of time and not a lot of money, so games got PLAYED.

Even then, I remember thinking at the time that ONM were off their nuts giving it 96% or whatever.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyWed 15 Nov 2023 - 10:58

96% Laughing

I'd forgotten about the mini-games! They're more of a SM64DS thing in my head, where I probably played too much of them (like you, I had a lot of time and none of my own money back then). One thing I do remember from then was the actual Mario multiplayer: maybe it wasn't great, but I played hours of it with my sis. Normally we'd just muck around in the levels until one of us hit the other with Shell Mario, which was the best use of that power-up. Good times.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyThu 16 Nov 2023 - 19:48

I’ve got a vague memory of seeing footage of New Super Mario Bros’ debut appearance as part of an E3 sizzle reel. It got an audible cheer from the audience in attendance but I don’t know, I thought it looked a bit rubbish at the time. NGC Magazine printed some screenshots of it in one of their Summer 2005 issues (which I’d flicked through again recently). Same thing: I thought it looked a bit rubbish off of that initial impression and when seeing the screenshots again in 2023.

Still, I knew it was a big deal to have an all-new 2D Mario platformer and so I bought it quite close to when it released. I had a notion that it would be my big ‘summer game’ for 2006, that it would be the DS title that would keep me entertained gaming-wise for months and provide me with excellent value for money as an unemployed seventeen year old who was in that awkward stage between finishing school and starting uni. It kind of didn’t to be honest. And I don’t think I ended up keeping it for very long. Looking at the comments I made in July 2013 in that thread Balladeer’s linked in his opening post, I’m shaking my head in disagreement. Maybe it’s true that New Super Mario Bros single-handedly brought 2D platformers back in vogue, but I don’t recall ever thinking it was the best game on the DS. It was pretty good, aye, but in hindsight it could have been a lot more ambitious and creative.

The newly-relaunched NGamer Magazine reviewed it in their first issue and gave it 89%. Yet I remember that the score mismatched with the negative content of the written review itself. I thought that it showed that NGamer Magazine was going to have a critical edge towards Nintendo’s first-party stuff that its predecessors typically didn’t, but naw, that never happened.

Last thought: I’ve got an unboxed, a boxed and a sealed copy of New Super Mario Bros. here around the house. *shrugs*
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyFri 17 Nov 2023 - 2:05

I have British, American and Japanese copies here in my apartment for some reason.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySat 18 Nov 2023 - 9:31

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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySat 18 Nov 2023 - 9:49

I thought it was nice enough, but never felt as memorable as 3/World did. But then there was a huge gap, and so it's probably just being a grown-up Sad
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySat 18 Nov 2023 - 10:00

I think that's an entirely valid criticism, Jim. We'll get into it with some of the sequels, I'm sure, but while I think there's a high level of competence with the series, I don't think they did a good job of establishing an identity either visually or with a particular gimmick.

With the NES and SNES games, the spritework is so distinctive you immediately know which Mario you're looking at. Even between 64, Sunshine, Galaxy and Odyssey, the different lighting, animation and so on makes each Mario distinct. Even removed from any context, a Galaxy Mario is obvious.

NSMB had very generic versions of the characters, the enemies, the level furniture and everything else.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySat 18 Nov 2023 - 15:36

Okay now that people have started being slightly more critical, I think I can come out with some of my takes.  Some.

I don't dislike NSMB in and of itself.  I think if there hadn't been three more games in the style, I'd have been happy enough with it as a one-off back-to-basics.  I don't think you even get my sulky post in the voting thread without NSMBWii.  All the same, I was never too enthusiastic, and it's for reasons you folks have given: 'it could [should] have been a bit more ambitious and creative', 'never felt as memorable as 3/World did', and 'they did[n't do] a good job of establishing an identity'.  

I played World for the first time in its re-release on GBA too, so it wasn't like the gap was so big for me.  To play something so 'by-the-numbers' (to quote myself from the voting thread) after the imagination shown in that game, from the former masters of the genre, was galling.  Heck, even the Land games on Game Boy bled with much more imagination and ambition than NSMB.  However bobbins Land 1 looks now, you don't get an Easter Island level or Bermudan robots with flying heads in the DS game.

That said, NSMB was definitely the best out of the first three anyway.  It was solid, and it did have that multiplayer.  The Shell and Mega Mushroom are probably the sub-series' best items too.  If it had come from anybody else, starred anything else, and wasn't putting itself up against World for competition along with three other following games in the same vein, I'd probably have felt on the higher side of neutral towards it.  Ironically I might have been 'blinded by the plumber's presence' myself.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySun 19 Nov 2023 - 16:04

Man, rereading that DS voting thread, what the hell was I thinking calling NSMB "the best 2D platformer of all time"? Bonkers. My first ever game was SML2 and I'd rate that above NSMB any day of the week!

NSMB did kill a lot of time for me, for what it's worth though. Back when I fancied a break from the plethora of RPGs I had for the system, it was easy to fire up NSMB and bash through a few levels. It's a safe and inoffensive game at its core and is still pretty fun to play.

The issue is that I think the formula has been homogenised with the other NSMB games that came after this one. It really colours my opinion of this game and makes it hard for me to look at this game in a bubble so to speak.

Still, the minigames were fun, at least!
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyMon 20 Nov 2023 - 20:01

DS Voting Thread Redo when? Winky Face


~  ~  ~

New Super Mario Bros. Wii (Wii, 2009)

New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) New-super-mario-bros-wii-screenshot

This wasn't my first choice of Mario game... but then it wasn't really aimed at me was it?  This was Nintendo bringing 2D Mario to the Wii Sports generation, which it did with simplicity, a clean simple look (that, er, looks a lot like the original NSMB Shifty ), the Super Guide functionality, and the big change: multiplayer!  I never played NSMBWii as it was intended, which was as a chaotic game with four people bouncing off each other.  It added some other things too, bringing us Propeller and Penguin Mario (n'awww), returning Yoshi to the fray, and bringing back the Koopalings.  At the time it was an exciting return for villains that hadn't been seen since the GBA, or the SNES in platformers, even if later NSMB games would wear them out a bit.

So, what are your memories of the game that dragged Mario back into multiplayer?  Inquiring minds need to know!
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyTue 21 Nov 2023 - 4:08

Now here's a game I certainly owned, as you may have come to expect though that's about the limit of my views on this, I'm pretty sure I never played this in multiplayer (NSMBU would be the first to get that honour) so it would have been a strictly single player affair. I guess the best thing I could say is that it felt that way too, meaning it avoided the curse of empty feeling levels like many Wii era games didn't. Propeller and Penguin power ups were great additions and to date some of my favourites of the more recent power ups even if the former felt like it made things a bit easy.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyTue 21 Nov 2023 - 6:55



This released when I was playing a lot of local multiplayer on Wii, and we definitely had some fun times with it. Since then, I did the whole campaign in two-player with my friend Rob, and it was a lot of fun. Sometimes we helped one another, at other times hindered. I think it probably would feel like it has aged badly as a solo game, because the levels are a little wider and emptier to facillitate multiplayer fun. I think the sharper visuals of the Wii U game allow the camera to zoom out and incorporate more players while still having actual packed level design.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyTue 21 Nov 2023 - 9:47

I never owned NSMBWii - in fact, I think I played it literally once at a mate’s house. Much like Buska mentioned in his video, it was glorious chaos playing through a few levels and quickly deteriorated into a griefing session as we each tried to lob each other into pits and generally got in each other’s way. I’d imagine it’s a tighter experience in two player mode - indeed, it sounds like it is going by the above - but I don’t have any experience beyond that one marvellous evening with the game.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyTue 21 Nov 2023 - 11:07

Even in two player mode, by the latest worlds it felt like we were in each others way but it felt good to finally beat the game together.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyWed 22 Nov 2023 - 17:45

It’s a fine game that belongs in any game collection. Being really playable, having a good difficulty curve and featuring decent number of levels helps it stand out from it’s many peers (which I felt were flawed in one way or another – dodgy controls, too short, rubbish tunes, etc). I remember it feeling a bit fresher than the DS New Super Mario Bros. game as well, there was lots of fun ideas here. At the time I was a little disappointed with the graphics, but with hindsight they really weren’t that much different from New Super Mario Bros. U’s on the HD-ready Wii U. Otherwise though, I thought it was good stuff and debatably one of the Wii’s best platformers.

I didn’t get to play the multiplayer too often, but I mostly remember it being an entertaining time. That said, I don’t think I’ve ever been as infuriated playing any game ever as I was the time I had to explain to a pal how to play a 2D Super Mario game. This was a guy who had Super Mario Sunshine too! He didn’t know there was a run button, or what the mushroom power-up did, or why there was a flagpole at the end of each level, or why you couldn't kick enemies, or why you couldn’t jump down all the pits – I don’t think we was yanking my chain either, I think he genuinely had no clue. Every ten seconds there was a new question or a life stupidly lost, he couldn’t make sense of any of it. I was completely aghast - I mean, it's 2D Mario, go right and don't be a wank!
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyWed 22 Nov 2023 - 21:25

Christ. I feel like anybody who's even had a passing interest in games knows what the mushroom does in Super Mario. Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyThu 23 Nov 2023 - 7:19

Before modern society, that kind would be weeded out by natural selection.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyFri 24 Nov 2023 - 20:06

The Cappuccino Kid wrote:
..debatably one of the Wii’s best platformers.

Oh wow.  In one player?  That's certainly a debate!  I thought our voting thread top five of Galaxy, Galaxy 2, Kirby's Epic Yarn, Donkey Kong Country Returns, and even Rayman Origins (which I didn't care for much) were all streets ahead of NSMBWii.  Granted there's not a lot of depth after that, but that says more about the Wii than NSMBWii in one-player I reckon!

Briefly, my take on one-player NSMBWii is that it's the only new Mario game released since 64 where I haven't finished the campaign.  I remember the level I gave up on too: a fleet of flying Buzzy Beetles.  I looked at the vast empty space and lack of interesting level furniture, realised that this summed up the game on my tod, and quit pretty much immediately.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySat 25 Nov 2023 - 8:06

If we're just counting 2D platformers, I'd probably only put DKCR above it, but yeah that's a result of a limited selection.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySat 25 Nov 2023 - 9:24

It may be sacrilegious but I'd have to agree with Rayman being above it too, it just feels like it has more character than NSMBWii and gameplay-wise I couldn't separate the two.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptySun 26 Nov 2023 - 19:37

I'm also of the opinion that Rayman Origins and Donkey Kong Country Returns are objectively better than New Super Mario Bros. Wii. It's still very good though.

My memories of the red-cased, giant coin collecting platformer are that it was in everyone's Wii collection, mainly because it was Mario, and it had four-player chaos. But the one-player mode was a good time, and outside of Mario's acrobatics on Donkey Kong 94, it's probably the best fun I've had with Mario in 2D. It might even be underrated, because next to Mario Galaxy it doesn't compare. Definitely one I'll revisit over Christmas.
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyMon 27 Nov 2023 - 15:58

gjones wrote:
...outside of Mario's acrobatics on Donkey Kong 94, it's probably the best fun I've had with Mario in 2D.

Get on Mario Wonder, man, and fast!


~  ~  ~

New Super Mario Bros. 2 (3DS, 2012)

New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) Ed7c04e3

Coins and coins and coins and coins...  It's a slightly odd thing for a Mario game to focus on isn't it?  He's always had coins, they're not the most interesting aspect.  Yet here we are, with NSMB2 going all in on cold hard cash.  So, you had the Gold Flower power-up, the Coin Rush mode, rewards for reaching 1m and 10m - 1 coins, that block that sticks on Mario's head and leaves a coin trail...  Perhaps the more interesting aspects are the return of the Raccoon Mario's flight mode, and the auto-running cannon levels, precursors of Super Mario Run by four years and all those bloody Mario Maker levels by three.

What are your memories of the game that celebrated capitalism like no Mario game before it?  Inquiring minds need to know!
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PostSubject: Re: New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!)   New Super Mario Bros. November (NSMBU Discussion!) EmptyTue 28 Nov 2023 - 9:42



This is such a weird one. I think the DS and subsequently 3DS were perfect machines for getting stuck into this kind of thing, but releasing after the 3DS already had 3D Land and so incredibly close to NSMBU meant I really struggled to care about this game at the time. I don't even know if I finished it back in the day, but I did for the 35-second series.

As I understand it, pumping out this and U so close together led directly to the creation of Mario Maker, which is cool, but I don't remember a single level or moment from this game.
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