Saving the forum today: The HM05!
 
HomeHome  TwitterTwitter  YouTubeYouTube  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  GintendoGintendo  GRcadeGRcade  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  

Share
 

 I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game

Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
AuthorMessage
Treesmurf
Yoshi
Treesmurf

Posts : 2622
Points : 2617
Join date : 2013-01-17
Age : 29
Location : Manneh

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySat 27 Oct 2018 - 18:56

Diamond, Pearl and Platinum didn't fair well in my vote for much the reasons you'd expect with the teething problems of D/P, Platinum obviously did a great job at improving them but I'd also add the generation of new Pokemon is the weakest, it's so reliant on previous gens.

Sent from Topic'it App
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://www.youtube.com/user/treesmurf11/featured
JayMoyles
Nayru's Wisdom
JayMoyles

Posts : 12977
Points : 12382
Join date : 2013-01-21
Age : 25
Location : Courtroom No. 3 at 10am.

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySat 27 Oct 2018 - 21:25

Did Bewear really pick up two votes Drunka or did you just want a bear in the top 6? Wink

It'd be quite fun to see what folks voted as their favourites outside of the big six there, so I hope you'll post the full results for that category at least. Thumbs Up!

Now... fingers crossed that we don't get a certain game as our number one...
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.jamesjmoyles.blogspot.com
Athrun888
Dry Metal Baby Princess
Athrun888

Posts : 3493
Points : 3540
Join date : 2013-01-26
Location : The Cognitive Realm

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 8:51

I wonder who voted for the Rowlett family!?  Wink

For those wondering what the Poke picks outside the big two were, here's mine.

Spoiler'd in case they get posted officially:
 

And now to brace myself for the inevitable and most undeserving winner to claim its spot and the inevitability of my having to explain why, in detail, it doesn't deserve said spot (and believe me I absolutely can, I can write a veritable essay on it if I really wanted.  I don't want to, nobody even reads my posts when I go into detail and it's a waste of a solid 45 minutes of my life, but I can do it and will do it).  

Perhaps I should have voted strategically and put Gold and Silver first. . .
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Drunkalilly
Prince of Altea
Drunkalilly

Posts : 10795
Points : 10932
Join date : 2013-02-25
Age : 28
Location : Nagano

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 9:35

Larvitar nearly made the list - someone voted for Tyranitar - but then I spotted that someone else had voted for a bear. 2 points for the same monster is worth more than 2 in the same family.

JayMoyles wrote:
Did Bewear really pick up two votes Drunka or did you just want a bear in the top 6? Wink

It really did! If I was gonna fake it I'd have picked Ursaring or Beartic, as they're the most like real bears. There's also Snorlax to consider before we get to Bewear.

Quote :
It'd be quite fun to see what folks voted as their favourites outside of the big six there, so I hope you'll post the full results for that category at least. Thumbs Up!

I'd like to promise that but itd be a ballache . . . lets put it in the same pile as "music to my ears" and the gracklecast.
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://www.gintendo.co.uk/a-luke-at-japan
masofdas
Disciple of Reggie
masofdas

Posts : 17727
Points : 17993
Join date : 2013-01-18
Age : 29
Location : VITA Island

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 10:04

@Athrun I think both me and OR would redo are votes if we could as we missed G/S or HG/SS in are Top 10's.

I guess Shanks didn't vote looking at the Eevee section.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Drunkalilly
Prince of Altea
Drunkalilly

Posts : 10795
Points : 10932
Join date : 2013-02-25
Age : 28
Location : Nagano

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 11:48

Right. Here we go.

GNamer's Favourite Pokémon Game:
Spoiler:
 

You said:
 
I say:
 

GNamer's Favourite Main Series Pokémon Games:
Spoiler:
 

My number one votes matched the overall number one, spin-off number one and main series number one. And I genuinely voted before seeing anyone else’s posts. RESULT!

That said, Pokken didn’t even make an appearance . . .
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://www.gintendo.co.uk/a-luke-at-japan
Crumpy Andy
Baby Brush God
Crumpy Andy

Posts : 4249
Points : 4253
Join date : 2013-01-15
Age : 26
Location : The South

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 12:02

Got to say that's a little bit of a disappointing finale considering Sun & Moon is the only Pokemon game I waited so long to pick and an also the only one I've not been arsed to finish (or get to the first trial even).

Oh well.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
masofdas
Disciple of Reggie
masofdas

Posts : 17727
Points : 17993
Join date : 2013-01-18
Age : 29
Location : VITA Island

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 12:16

Yeah disappointing Number 1 in the end on both Top 10 and Main Top 5, thankfully Main Top 5 looks better but again I only voted for HGSS and not G/S which I really should have even with only 5 votes.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Athrun888
Dry Metal Baby Princess
Athrun888

Posts : 3493
Points : 3540
Join date : 2013-01-26
Location : The Cognitive Realm

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 13:19

Before I get started I'll preface this by saying I'd like to think the following isn't a rant, so much as a very critical write-up of my issues with Sun and Moon, with my going out of my way to make sure there are proper points being made ect ect ect.  I have as much time for incoherent ranting as I do Wayne knocking his litterbox filled with presents over for me to clean up.  I feel this disclaimer is likely necessary because, as is common with textwalls, one tends to see one of them and immediately nope out, especially if one suspects it to be an incoherent rant.  

------------------------------------------

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Grumpy10

I promised everything wrong with Pokemon Sun and Moon, so here's everything wrong with them, and why they are the most unfun Pokemon games to play (okay, a little stretch there, the biggest problem with Sun and Moon is that they're a blast to play when it gets things right, and that it goes out of its own way to bog things down.  Aaaaaand that's the joke ruined.)

I said it earlier and I'll say it again.  Sun and Moon have, speaking as someone who lived and breathed Pokemon (GO has reignited my passion for the franchise itself, but not for the main series, which shall remain untouched), killed the series for me (eh who am I kidding, we all know I'll still buy and play gen 8, and likely even go out of my way to have a Switch well in advance of its release).  

But why has it killed the series you ask.  After all, they had some of the most fun boss fights this side of Cynthia (best boss in a Pokemon game and you're factually wrong if you argue otherwise! Wink ), the region was exceptionally well designed from an aesthetic standpoint, and the Pokemon were some of the most consistently well designed since Gold and Silver!  How can a game with all of that be bad, or have killed your interest in the series!

Very very simple.  You know how people like to mock JRPG's for being bogged down with story?  Yep, that's the core of Sun and Moon's problems.  It is, however, only the core.  If the story had been good, if it had some genuinely engaging characters for its entire duration (instead of, say, the vapid Hau and incompetent Lilli, both of whom pinched the limelight from more deserving characters like Edgy McEdgeface and Ya Boi Guzma), instead of constantly thrusting the player into cutscene after cutscene, to the point it is almost an hour before you so much as pick your starter Pokemon (a process which itself is bogged down with a overly-gratuitous and vapid cutscene that loses all charm on a replay), then this approach might well have worked.  

Or if they'd simply added in the ability to skip cutscenes (a concept that has been in JRPG's for over a decade now by the way), this issue could have been mitigated that way.  

This seemingly small problem kicks off a domino effect for the rest of the games issues.  The player is constantly thrust into cutscenes, where overly friendly and vapid characters will tell you where to go, and even what to do when you get there.  Remember in the original games where you had to actually explore and find where your next destination was?  Yeah, they completely killed it with this game, instead treating the player like some sort of utterly incompetent child (incompetent being the important term, Pokemon has and always will be aimed at children and I am neither blind to this nor expectant of anything different.  But there was always a sense of respect in older games that is lacking in this one).  

To put it extremely bluntly Sun and Moon were the first Pokemon games I've played that actually made me feel like I might be too old for the game I was playing (outside of some of the rougher boss battles, natch.  Some of those were seriously on point).  

In fact the game did the exact opposite of what Zelda: Breath of the Wild did.  Where Breath of the Wild was a breath of fresh air because it did the earth-shattering concept of treating the player not only like they'd played a game before, but that they might have also played a Zelda game or several before (while still also finding ways to guide new players) Pokemon Sun and Moon acted like this was not only the players first Pokemon game, but possibly their first experience with a video game and that they might be too incompetent to learn very fast how to play it.  Issues like the insufferable "How to catch a Pokemon tutorial" found themselves not only amplified, but permeating most of the game.  

And this is why I said earlier that Sun and Moon made a great first impression, only to murder those impressions with the fury of a rampaging Gyarados later (and to be honest nearer the end of the game itself).  If they'd had the audacity to treat the player with respect, if they'd ditched a solid 50 percent of the cutscenes, I strongly believe they would actually be up there.  The ingredients of greatness is indeed in Sun and Moon.  It is, unfortunately, eclipsed by all of the absolute utterly vapid tripe one has to wade through to actually get to it.  

The funny thing about all of this is that Sun and Moon managed to do the exact opposite of what Platinum did.  Back when I first played Gen 4 (Diamond) I found it incredibly dull and tedious.  So much so it was the catalyst for my trading all of my Pokemon games in.  Pokemon Platinum got me back on the train, but it wasn't until Heart Gold and Soul Silver, remakes of my then-favourite-games-of-all-time that I returned to Pokemon with the same passion I had before (and boy did I return, I must've sunk over 400 hours into HG and Platinum cumulatively)

Even then I still felt generation four, with the exception of the Johto remakes, to be a tad dull.  It wasn't until several years later, about a year after Black and Whites release, where I undertook my first Nuzlocke (as part of a group challenge), that I went back to Platinum (to nuzlocke it, natch).  It was then that everything clicked.  The balance between guidance and exploration, the intense and genuinely rough boss battles, and even the story (people like to praise Ghetsis for being the meanest baddie in the franchise, but Cyrus was one creepy sociopathic motherbleeper).  

At this point I suspect I'll dissolve into rambling, I've made my points anyway, and written enough.  I did promise a lengthy one after all! So, there you are. That's why I consider Sun and Moon to not even be in the top eight Pokemon games. Note that none of what I said means I consider them bad games, simply that they aren't anywhere near up to the snuff of what came before.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Drunkalilly
Prince of Altea
Drunkalilly

Posts : 10795
Points : 10932
Join date : 2013-02-25
Age : 28
Location : Nagano

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 14:07

Oooh, I've been waiting for this Athrun post. I am ready to rumble!

Athrun888 wrote:

Cynthia (best boss in a Pokemon game and you're factually wrong if you argue otherwise!   Wink ),

Okay, well at least we're starting off on the same foot.
Athin a laff wrote:

Very very simple.  You know how people like to mock JRPG's for being bogged down with story?  Yep, that's the core of Sun and Moon's problems.

And that's the end of me agreeing with you. After Gen 5 felt like a story more about N than the player character, and X and Y had a whole club of boring friends, I was all the way up for Sun's story. The actual quest to become champion was, as well as being revitalised, pushed once again to the forefront. That we still had excellent villainous team(s) content around that made it feel like a bonus, like it did back in the day.
Athro Samurai wrote:

if it had some genuinely engaging characters for its entire duration (instead of, say, the vapid Hau and incompetent Lilli, both of whom pinched the limelight from more deserving characters like Edgy McEdgeface and Ya Boi Guzma),
Guzma and Gladion are memorable because their appearances are limited. If they were overdone, they'd have grated. On the other hand, while Hau isn't especially exciting, he's completely inoffensive and worked well as a recurring character. See also Lillie, whose character arc explored the nature of people's relationship with Pokemon (this is the big theme of the game which made it shine so much for me, more on that later no doubt) and she actually develops to boot.

888Casino wrote:
Or if they'd simply added in the ability to skip cutscenes (a concept that has been in JRPG's for over a decade now by the way), this issue could have been mitigated that way.  

I'll give you that, that shit's indefensible.

Athrun out of good puns already wrote:
Remember in the original games where you had to actually explore and find where your next destination was?  Yeah, they completely killed it with this game, instead treating the player like some sort of utterly incompetent child (incompetent being the important term, Pokemon has and always will be aimed at children and I am neither blind to this nor expectant of anything different.  But there was always a sense of respect in older games that is lacking in this one).

I'll tell you what I remember: incredibly small and simplistic 2D maps which could be learned in no time at all. Sun and Moon gives more direction in the overall adventure but that allows it to have a bigger, more living world. The depth of the game, as it has always been really, is in the monsters, the capturing and training of them, and the ancilliary material around the core story.  

Athrunescape wrote:
To put it extremely bluntly Sun and Moon were the first Pokemon games I've played that actually made me feel like I might be too old for the game I was playing


I can't argue that they did or didn't make you feel that way. Nonetheless, I feel like there must be some kind of response to your comment . . .

A very wise man wrote:
I didn't like Sun and Moon, that makes them the objective worst video games in the history of the medium.  I also despise avocados, making them the single worst vegetable to pair with food.  And eggs, do not even get me started on the revolting things that are boiled, scrambled, or poached eggs.  

Don't get me wrong, at the end of the day everything is subjective, but if you're going to throw claims such as "it's actively bad" around you should back it up with well articulated reasoning.  Otherwise all you're basically doing is setting out some very mouldy bait.  

Athrun888 wrote:
Pokemon Sun and Moon acted like this was not only the players first Pokemon game, but possibly their first experience with a video game
This was a deliberate and reasonable move, considering the time and circumstances of release.

Athrun888 wrote:
And this is why I said earlier that Sun and Moon made a great first impression, only to murder those impressions with the fury of a rampaging Gyarados later

I can only disagree with you fundamentally here. While the opening was tutorial-heavy, it gave way to an adventure with an engaging story with a lot to say. I enjoyed thoroughly my playthrough of the adventure. I appreciated the characters, story, world, monsters and the way it so heavily featured Pokemon in its world.

Athrun888 wrote:

Even then I still felt generation four, with the exception of the Johto remakes, to be a tad dull.  It wasn't until several years later, about a year after Black and Whites release, where I undertook my first Nuzlocke (as part of a group challenge), that I went back to Platinum (to nuzlocke it, natch).  It was then that everything clicked.  The balance between guidance and exploration, the intense and genuinely rough boss battles.  

This is where I think our fundamental difference shines through. You want your Pokemon games to be difficult. I understand this impulse: I love Dark Souls after all, and have fond memories of struggling through certain battles in the Pokemon series. That said, I play DS like a comfort blanket now, and have finished the first and second generation Pokemon games this year (including trainer Red) without blacking out once. Games now will never be as hard as they were when you were a kid, and to make Pokemon super hard now would involve not making it Pokemon at all. I like being free to complete the story with monsters I like and minimal difficulty. Challenge is there if you want in the collecting aspect, in competitive gaming, in post-game content. I like this 3D mario approach to letting anyone reach the credits but hiding way more under the hood.


Athrun888 wrote:
At this point I suspect I'll dissolve into rambling, I've made my points anyway, and written enough.  I did promise a lengthy one after all!  So, there you are.  That's why I consider Sun and Moon to not even be in the top eight Pokemon games.  Note that none of what I said means I consider them bad games, simply that they aren't anywhere near up to the snuff of what came before.  

Okay. I've read your arguments, I understand them, I reject them.

For me, Pokemon Sun and Moon were the culmination of what I'd always wanted from the series. The world was full to the brim with Pokemon which could be interacted with and which were relevant to the story. The world was alive and interesting and made me want to explore it. Treating my Pokemon kindly actually made them the best they could be, like charatcers had always told me was the case even though before it was better to treat them like numbers on a spreadsheet.

Sun and Moon were the first Pokemon games where the things I loved about the series were actually on the screen, not just in my imaginary interpretation of the sprites.
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://www.gintendo.co.uk/a-luke-at-japan
Balladeer
Disciple of Miyamoto
Balladeer

Posts : 19605
Points : 18629
Join date : 2013-01-16
Age : 29
Location : Admintown

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 28 Oct 2018 - 14:37

S&M got rid of HMs, therefore they are good boys.  Their monsters are good too.  Pleased with that, very well deserved.

Drunkalilly wrote:
What's not to love?

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Latest?cb=20161130173554

Treesmurf wrote:
Diamond, Pearl and Platinum didn't fair well in my vote for much the reasons you'd expect with the teething problems of D/P, Platinum obviously did a great job at improving them but I'd also add the generation of new Pokemon is the weakest, it's so reliant on previous gens.

This is exactly right and my reason for leaving out that gen.  Platinum would have made it if they were done separately.
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://balladsandwords.wordpress.com/
OrangeRakoon
Bandana Waddle Dee
OrangeRakoon

Posts : 876
Points : 879
Join date : 2015-05-06
Age : 27
Location : Reading, UK

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyMon 29 Oct 2018 - 11:01

I am the other Bewear voter B)

He is my second favourite pokemon of all time, right after Mimikyu (who I'm a bit surprised no one else voted for!). The strength of the new pokemon designs is part of the reason Sun and Moon were great. I also voted for Squirtle as my first pokemon and for the squirtle squad, so I'm happy to have two pokemon in the final list.

On the subject of Sun/Moon and Platinum, I'll start with adding reason to why I really didn't like Platinum: The new pokemon are mostly naff, the game structure starts very tired and doesn't do anything new, and I got a pseudo-legendary pokemon within like 30 minutes which I found incredibly dumb.

On the flip-side, Sun/Moon shake up the formula and actually offer a new experience with both the story and structure and the game mechanics like HMs, they blend the new and nostalgia perfectly together with the mix of old and new pokemon (and the alolan formes are inspired), the new designs are generally very good (as I said Mimikyu and Bewear are my two favourite pokemon), and the world generally does a great job of capturing the pokemon spirit. It's also the closest we've ever got to a pokemon snap sequel!
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.orkn.uk
Treesmurf
Yoshi
Treesmurf

Posts : 2622
Points : 2617
Join date : 2013-01-17
Age : 29
Location : Manneh

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyMon 29 Oct 2018 - 11:39

4 of my picks made the top 6 for favourite (Squirtle, Eevee, Mewtwo and Rowlett) with Pikachu missing out, a Pokemon I feel is getting a lot of uneccesary stick lately for being a Mascot. The other that missed out on mine was Swampert which I never expected to rank high, it holds a special place for me as the first one I trained up to level 100.

I can't say much more in defence of Sun and Moon that hasn't already been said, I feel it's the closest the games and anime have ever been in terms of character and presentation. Ultra Sun and Moon were disappointing though I should add.
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://www.youtube.com/user/treesmurf11/featured
JayMoyles
Nayru's Wisdom
JayMoyles

Posts : 12977
Points : 12382
Join date : 2013-01-21
Age : 25
Location : Courtroom No. 3 at 10am.

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyMon 29 Oct 2018 - 22:49

Drunkalilly wrote:

I'd like to promise that but itd be a ballache . . . lets put it in the same pile as "music to my ears" and the gracklecast.

Alright, alright, I get it. Laughing (to be fair though getting the Gracklecast going again is going to take a bit more work than normal considering Gintendo is MIA)

However this...

Athrun888 wrote:

For those wondering what the Poke picks outside the big two were, here's mine.

...is a great idea and so long as folks are happy in sharing, I'll get to see what everybody's favourite Pokémon are anyway!

Here are mine with my comments, although I've gutted Oddish's comment as you'll hopefully get to hear that on a certain Pokémon podcast soon enough!

My fave 'Mon:
 

As for Sun/Moon, I'm reasonably chuffed with the outcome although I do think that Athrun's point about the pacing feeling really slow due to the numerous cutscenes does hold some truth to it, but I think that it's only really at its worst in the opening bits of the game. It's a really slow starter for sure, but the adventure does ramp up once you get to the second island, I feel.

Cheers for putting together a solid vote, Drunka. Thumbs Up!
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.jamesjmoyles.blogspot.com
Drunkalilly
Prince of Altea
Drunkalilly

Posts : 10795
Points : 10932
Join date : 2013-02-25
Age : 28
Location : Nagano

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyTue 30 Oct 2018 - 2:09

JayMoyles wrote:
(to be fair though getting the Gracklecast going again is going to take a bit more work than normal considering Gintendo is MIA)
With the Gracklecast, I reckon it should be easy enough to start up a soundcloud. There aren't so many old casts to reupload and it doesn't have a subscriber base to try to move across. If you put them all on an RSS I'd find it easier to listen to the older ones I've been putting off, as well.

Quote :
Cheers for putting together a solid vote, Drunka. Thumbs Up!
It was fun!
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://www.gintendo.co.uk/a-luke-at-japan
masofdas
Disciple of Reggie
masofdas

Posts : 17727
Points : 17993
Join date : 2013-01-18
Age : 29
Location : VITA Island

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyTue 30 Oct 2018 - 7:16

I reckon I could have included THAT game, Jay Wink

Top vote even with the disappointing winner.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Balladeer
Disciple of Miyamoto
Balladeer

Posts : 19605
Points : 18629
Join date : 2013-01-16
Age : 29
Location : Admintown

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyTue 30 Oct 2018 - 19:08

Drunkalilly wrote:
Quote :
Cheers for putting together a solid vote, Drunka. Thumbs Up!
It was fun!
Ah, that's always important. I'm glad you enjoyed it my man. Thanks for providing it, and sorry for putting the kibosh on your Simply The Best post way back when!

Pokémons, eh?

Spoiler:
 

Bottom two could change any time - Sandslash, in particular, was very much a response to the LPP episode du jour. Espeon and Umbreon were just outside my top ten, as was Chandelure's younger sexier relative, Lampent. Good picks.

All of the rest of the original 151 are bobbins. Especially Pikachu. (Although Jay made a very impressive defence of Oddish that applies to nobody but him.)
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://balladsandwords.wordpress.com/
JayMoyles
Nayru's Wisdom
JayMoyles

Posts : 12977
Points : 12382
Join date : 2013-01-21
Age : 25
Location : Courtroom No. 3 at 10am.

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyTue 30 Oct 2018 - 19:52

Drunkalilly wrote:
JayMoyles wrote:
(to be fair though getting the Gracklecast going again is going to take a bit more work than normal considering Gintendo is MIA)
With the Gracklecast, I reckon it should be easy enough to start up a soundcloud. There aren't so many old casts to reupload and it doesn't have a subscriber base to try to move across. If you put them all on an RSS I'd find it easier to listen to the older ones I've been putting off, as well.

I'll give it a bash - I'm hoping to finally get the finger out and make a personal blog and get to writing again - I do miss it - and I'll have a place to host Mash and the Gracklecast, at least.

masofdas wrote:
I reckon I could have included THAT game, Jay Wink

Ha, very good. Laughing

Balladeer wrote:
 (Although Jay made a very impressive defence of Oddish that applies to nobody but him.)

Hey, I don't blame anybody for feeling apathetic towards Oddish - I'd likely have been the same had I not stopped at Burger King all those years ago.

Back on topic - for those that are going to pick up Let's Go...

Naturally it's way too early to tell, but based on early impressions do you reckon it'll end up charting in your top 10 Pokémon games?
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.jamesjmoyles.blogspot.com
Balladeer
Disciple of Miyamoto
Balladeer

Posts : 19605
Points : 18629
Join date : 2013-01-16
Age : 29
Location : Admintown

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyTue 30 Oct 2018 - 19:57

RB and XY made the back end of mine, so it has a good chance.
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://balladsandwords.wordpress.com/
masofdas
Disciple of Reggie
masofdas

Posts : 17727
Points : 17993
Join date : 2013-01-18
Age : 29
Location : VITA Island

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyTue 30 Oct 2018 - 20:04

I went for half mainline and half spin-offs which in hindsight might not have been a great idea. With let's go, its sort of in between both that could see it certainly making my Top 5 spin-offs which included the Pokémon Mini as I couldn't remember which two games I had.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Athrun888
Dry Metal Baby Princess
Athrun888

Posts : 3493
Points : 3540
Join date : 2013-01-26
Location : The Cognitive Realm

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyWed 31 Oct 2018 - 3:18

Just to clarify, for those thinking I'm done, I am in fact composing a reply to the reply! Just doing it very slowly, point by point. Making long posts that take the better part of an hour (when you add in the proof-reading, additions, and what-have-you) can get tiring when done too often. Those curious will be happy to know Hau in particular is going to come under some heavy fire!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Balladeer
Disciple of Miyamoto
Balladeer

Posts : 19605
Points : 18629
Join date : 2013-01-16
Age : 29
Location : Admintown

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptySun 4 Nov 2018 - 19:50

A week since the final results, it's time to unsticky this and watch it drift downstream. God speed.
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://balladsandwords.wordpress.com/
Drunkalilly
Prince of Altea
Drunkalilly

Posts : 10795
Points : 10932
Join date : 2013-02-25
Age : 28
Location : Nagano

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyMon 5 Nov 2018 - 0:42

how dare you
Back to top Go down
View user profile https://www.gintendo.co.uk/a-luke-at-japan
JayMoyles
Nayru's Wisdom
JayMoyles

Posts : 12977
Points : 12382
Join date : 2013-01-21
Age : 25
Location : Courtroom No. 3 at 10am.

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyMon 5 Nov 2018 - 19:36

I mean, I can sticky it again if you fancy collating and sharing everybody's top Pokémon team? Wink
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.jamesjmoyles.blogspot.com
Athrun888
Dry Metal Baby Princess
Athrun888

Posts : 3493
Points : 3540
Join date : 2013-01-26
Location : The Cognitive Realm

I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 EmptyThu 15 Nov 2018 - 10:59

*Cracks knuckles, puts on Sins of Hyrule*

>Black and White being N's story

You say that as if it's some sort of bad thing.  And yet N's character arc achieved many of the things you are attributing to Sun and Moon, such as tackling the themes of humans and Pokemon and their relationship both directly and robustly.  And it did them far better.  Sun and Moon's strength was the theme of overcoming ones own insecurities (as seen with both Lillie and Hau, less Hau's actual interactions and more because Gladion makes literally says as much).  

On top of that Black and White put an absolute ton of emphasis on the role of the Champion, far more-so than Sun and Moon.  Black and White tied it directly to the plot itself, making it not just a title, but also a symbol of power and a right to rule.  When it came time for the final showdown with N over the championship it was far more meaningful because of it.

Last, but not least, Sun and Moon's protagonist is every bit a non-entity as every single previous protagonist.  If anything the few attempts to make them an avatar fell completely flat, with the occasional "choice" having so little impact they often got the same lines of dialogue regardless of your choice (good god that is the laziest crap ever).  

>Guzma, Gladion, and matters of the cast

I didn't so much mean those two specifically should have been given top billing, simply that characters with a similair amount of bite and actual personality should have.  Either make the cast memorable or cut down the cutscenes.

As for Hau, he is absolutely offensive.  He spends the entire game, and I do mean the entire thing, randomly appearing constantly, yabbering on about how fun everything is and how great Malasada's are, and. .  .  That is actually all he does.  

Oh, sure, he had a arc happening in the background.  It was, however, so far in the background that you only know of its existence because Gladion outright spells it out in two or three throwaway pieces of dialogue.  We never see him grow, struggle, have conflict of a personal nature, or basically any other trait one would expect from a character that is three-dimensional.  

It is such that if Gladion hadn't flat out said twice during the game that Hau should stop being lazy and implying it's because of an inferiority complex born from being the grandson of the Kahuna we would never know.  This is, objectively, godawful storytelling.  

Remember when rivals actually had personality and arcs?  Like Silver, who started off as little better than an abusive thug who slowly but surely over the course of the game realised the errors of his ways and grew as a person. Not through trite dialogue, but because we, the player, kept wrecking him and forcing him to realise the error of his ideals about Pokemon.  Or Barry, whose intent on haste resulted in some nasty consequences for the creatures he loved which, again, made him see the errors of his ways.  Or N, arguably the most well-developed character in the entire franchise.  Hell even Bianca had a more meaningful and developed character and arc than Hau!  Bianca!

Hau is easily the blandest character in the franchise, so bland it is downright offensive.  And so every single time he walked into a cutscene and spouted his usual drivel or observations so obvious one would have to be brain-dead not to see them the cutscene itself suffered.  Couple that with the fact Sun and Moon constantly shove cutscenes down your throat. . .

And don't even get me started on Lillie, who is easily one of the worst examples of a "getting a spine and coming of age" arc I've ever seen.  The only real difference between her before and after the final Aether Foundation crusade is she frowns occasionally.  Oh, and she blew a flute!  Suuuuuper impressive feat that, truly inspirational and motivating thing that was.  As usual a non-Atlus JRPG that absolutely sucks at writing good female characters. The only good part is her confronting her mother, but even that loses some impact since it's not her, but we the player, who actually cause change there. She starts the game a damsel in distress in need of the avatars help, and she ends the game in the same position.

>Maps

And Sun and Moon's weren't small and extremely easy to learn?  The region was the smallest feeling region yet, and both Kalos and Unova felt larger.  That can likely be attributed to how they distributed their content, they spaced it out properly, and Unova especially had a bunch of honest to goodness dungeons (something Sun and Moon largely lacked besides Vast Pony Canyon).  

Lets be real here though, none of Pokemon's worlds "live and breath".  If I were to point to Nintendo games that can claim that feat I'd point to Majoras Mask, with its world filled with so much robust life even modern games have trouble matching it (oh they try, but few manage to give their denizens the life and soul MM gives its NPC's), or I'd point to Xenoblade X.  Or Breath of the Wild.  

Pokemon worlds are all highly mechanised and feel as such.  Which is fine, when they aren't constantly stopping the player from moving around with inane trite dialogue.

>Age appropriate content

Probably because I have never given a fiddle and couldn't give less of a fiddle today about entertainment and its target age group.    Hell I'm currently watching the 90's Powerpuff Girls and loving every second of it.  

>Circumstances of release

See I couldn't disagree more.  They were billed as the celebration and culmination of 20 years of history.  Lets look at what another big Nintendo series, Zelda, did with such a milestone.  It took many a design decision that knew it was a long franchise with multiple types of players, from completely green newbies to veterans with decades of experience under their belt, and it managed to cater to every single one.  In contrast S/M acted as if literally the only people playing were six year olds, and particularly dense six year olds at that.

Do not get me wrong, I'm not saying they shouldn't keep the games appropriate in design for children, that's their target audience.  What they shouldn't be doing, which Sun and Moon did, is act like literally every Pokemon game is exclusively for new young simple people.  A few respectful design choices like actually acknowledging the players choice when they say "no, I do understand how this mechanic works and don't need a five minute tutorial".  Sun and Moon took those sorts of things and made them the most obnoxious they've ever been.  

>Matters of difficulty

To be honest it's less I want a brutal challenge (if I want that I'll hit up Pokemon Showdown and test my battling skills against other competitively-minded people) and more I want a game that is tough enough that it makes me utilise the various mechanics it has to offer.  There are games out there that are so simple that despite holding a wealth of gameplay mechanics for the player to use the player never finds themselves in a position where they should actually bother.  

Pokemon often finds itself in that position.  It's not the only one though, I've often bumped up modern Fire Emblem games because the various mechanics find themselves only really shining on higher difficulties (and trivialising the lower ones).  

Nuzlockes also have the advantage of sometimes locking the player into using Pokemon they wouldn't normally deign to notice.  In Platinum for example I found myself using Bronzong for the ice gym, a Pokemon I'd have left in my box in any other sort of playthrough.  

To be fair to Sun and Moon they were one of the few times I was pushed into exploring mechanics properly, some of the boss battles were enjoyably rough.

To summarise: There is a great game in Sun and Moon. Probably a 9/10 game. However it is so bogged down with inanity, from rivals and vapid main characters to cutscenes that contribute absolutely nothing interesting to read, that the game becomes a slog. A slog that cuts down what could have been an excellent title into a merely slightly above average one.

Sun and Moon forget that the Pokemon series is at its best when it shuts up and lets players run around, defeating gyms and rivals and criminal gangs with their favourite crazy critters.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty
PostSubject: Re: I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game   I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game - Page 5 Empty

Back to top Go down
 
I Want To Vote The Very Best . . . Pokémon Game
Back to top 
Page 5 of 6Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
 Similar topics
-
» [JL4CP] Why I think you should vote for me
» Vote for pufy and y will pupil u
» Hi, I'm new erepublik
» Vote for our site's new favicon!
» Vote for da best Recolor!!!

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
GNamer Forum :: Gaming Miscellaneous :: General Gaming Discussions-
Jump to: