Random retro thoughts

If you think of anything that doesn't belong in any of the available threads or it doesn't quite deserve a thread of it's own then bung it in here.

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So I read a great interview with Mark Healey of Media Molecule in issue 139 of Retro gamer earlier today.

It covered how he got into the industry and the games he's worked on etc and it got me thinking how I'd like to see more films that cover a similar topic as I think there'd be lot of great stories to tell.

(Fun fact: Mark Healey was responsible for the graphics in the SNES & Mega Drive versions of Theme Park which he completed in 3 days)

Hearing how people developed games in the "olden days" is fascinating. I always assumed they were mega space-wizards or something when I was a kid. But I remember Greener mention on TRP that e.g. people porting arcade games used to stand at the screen with tracing paper. So archaic.


Speaking of archaic, here's WHSmith's 1989 video promo loop for videogames. Spot which major section of the gaming market they don't cover. Also features a guest VO from the late great Emlyn Hughes.

Anyone got much experience with any retro computers that could be used for gaming as I was looking at the MSX last night but then saw Metal Gear which I would want for it is £200+ to buy meaning I'm not getting that.

Just wondering about the others as I know Jim is a fan of the BBC Micro and did his feature but are any of these computers really worth our time?

Short answer: no, unless you have nostalgia.

However, if you were to dive in: for computer hardware that has not stood the test of time, this is where you do want an emulator. Where the machines aren't being produced, and no-one is maintaining the usage or the rights to the firmware, it's just assumed that people are going to emulate it, and in fact if any fools people are deliberately developing software for these old machines, they're also automatically producing images to be used on emulators; that's certainly true for the BBC Micro, Commodore, Spectrum and so on. Old hardware tends to fail, and the computer industry is a rare example of things being made less well in the olden days (we went through 6 or 7 Acorn Electrons, due to motherboards and RAM dying); the rarity of working old bits also sprials up the cost - hence the £200 MSX. Where people try and make new hardware, unless it's for systems which already have a wide userbase (e.g. the Retron 5), it's not cost-effective to make new hardware with now-archaic specs - the Spectrum Vega is still £83.95 on Amazon, and it's replicating a system with 48K of RAM.

I've sort of got Nostalgia as I remember having Spectrum ZX +2 and a friend having one as well which was his dads and playing Donkey Kong along with Mario Bros on it.

I've had a C64 at one point and even Amiga 500 (I think, it was a 500) but for some reason I started to look at old consoles and computers I've never owned on eBay and due to me being fond of Metal Gear (which £200+ not the computer), I'd thought I'd look at the MSX for one.

I could emulate but I also prefer playing on the actual hardware or a official means like the VC.

I have some recollection of playing my dad's ZX Spectrum. More accurately, fiddling about with my dad's Spectrum and marvelling at all the tapes and the tales he told of copying games/ programming his own, then playing everything through emulation.

We had an Atari 65XE, which was Atari's answer to the Spectrum/C64 and about 1% as popular. It had some lovely games (Chuckie Egg, Centipede, that one where you were a tadpole that had to survive into froghood) but I am glad we've moved away from joysticks - joypads are comfy and easy to wear. Or something.

ZeroJones wrote:

that one where you were a tadpole that had to survive into froghood

Savage Pond? That Atari version looks much better than the Acorn version. Plus, I assume this version didn't have a bug in which, occasionally if you didn't press a movement button as you started a new game, the tadpole would disappear from existence and the game was basically knackered.

Read the retro books from gJones and yep I've decided from what are meant to be the best games of some micro computers that I don't need any of them and I'm not going out of my way to get one.

Unless I go to a boot sale and I see a C64 for tuppence that's when I would pick one up.

Jimbob wrote:

ZeroJones wrote:

that one where you were a tadpole that had to survive into froghood

Savage Pond? That Atari version looks much better than the Acorn version. Plus, I assume this version didn't have a bug in which, occasionally if you didn't press a movement button as you started a new game, the tadpole would disappear from existence and the game was basically knackered.

It was Savage Pond! :nostalgia: That took me right back, that did. We were so addicted that we once played the game during a lightning storm, and the screen went totally white at one point.

Hmmm... I might have to watch a YouTube play or something - it would be nice to see that game, but actually playable!

Sorry, me again.

Do you remember Alfred Chicken?

Do you remember what PR and marketing was like in the early 90s?

The answer to both of these questions
IS THIS.

Drunkalilly wrote:

Jimbob wrote:

THIS.

HELP ME FIND THE WATERING CAN - THAT'S A CLUE KIDS.

The podcast Vidjagame Apocalypse has started running with this - it's their Solve My Maze at the moment.

Now that the PS1 Classic is almost out (doesn't seem great, maybe I shouldn't have asked for one for Christmas but not sure what else I would have asked for) and we've had an NES & SNES plus a billion Mega Drive or 2600 things which leads me to what classic system would you like to see next?

Personally, it's a console I've never owned and that's the PC Engine systems AKA Turbo-Grafx. I don't know what all the best games are on the PCE family but I do know about things like Castlevania Rondo of Blood, Bomberman 94, Ys series, Bonk series, Snatcher, Puyo Puyo and a really good version of Street Fighter II.

What system would you like to see?

A year ago, I'd have said that I'd like to see a PSone Classic and a NeoGeo Mini arcade machine. I think I actually said those, in other threads. Anyway, it's disheartening that the general opinion is that they both disappoint. For that reason, I don't have a lot of confidence in Sony to do a PS2 Classic, which would have been my new first choice. I also think the choice of PS2 games on PS4 is bollocks, and it doesn't inspire a lot of hope that Sony would get it right for a PlayStation 2 Classic.

So...I don't really know what I'd want. I've got no need for anything before the GameCube generation to be honest, and I've got almost everything I'd want on PS2 and GameCube. I'd maybe like an Xbox Classic, but it would mostly be stuffed with games I'm not into, probably. After that, I'm not too fussed. Maybe a PSP Classic, someday?

The 6th gen doesn't seem that long ago to be having Classic's then dam the PS2 is what 18 year's old. I don't really know what would even be on it as think it would have the same issue as the PS1 that the games people associated with it are sort on everything, licensed or been remastered in some way.

Xbox does have a lot of exclusives but would backwards compatibility hinder that? GameCube does out of the four (you didn't bring up the Dreamcast) seem the most logical as it wouldn't have the PlayStation issue as it could have 20 Nintendo games and with lack of Virtual Console nothing to hinder it either.

N64 Classic.

The PS2 has such a large library that any system they put out, will inevitably disappoint.

A Dreamcast Classic would be great, and a lot of the games are already available on places like Steam, so sticking them on a Dreamcast shaped hard-drive should be easy enough. The one I would most likely purchase is a SEGA Saturn Classic, but I understand that's as likely as Tottenham winning a trophy any time soon.

Yeah, the man Jones is right - the N64 really is the only thing I'd really like a mini version of. There are still plenty of great games on there.

As much as I'm a fan of the clunky old computers we had in Britain before the consoles arrived, the games don't stand up, old joysticks were horrible until Gunpei Yokoi saved the day, and ultimately they're computer-shaped things. If anything, I'd like someone to but up a bunch of old licenses of the sort of quirky games that were made in Britain in the 80s, give them a Quality Of Life upgrade, and sell a bundle on Steam rather than a new piece of plastic.

An N64 Classic does bank on getting an agreement in place with Rare, you'd imagine. Although, that's probably likelier than we'd think with Nintendo and Microsoft palling about these days.

I don't know if we've had this discussion on the forum before, but what would your N64 Classic line up look like?

Off the top of my head...


I'd very much hope to see Super Mario 64, The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time and GoldenEye 007 on an N64 Classic, as they're the three games most synonymous with the N64. The first two are inevitable, but GoldenEye probably can't be helped.



For first party games, I'd appreciate having Mario Kart 64, Super Smash Bros., Wave Race 64, F-Zero X, Kirby 64, Yoshi's Story, 1080 Snowboarding, Lylat Wars, Sin & Punishment, Mario Party 3, Mario Tennis, Mario Golf, Paper Mario, Pilotwings 64, Pokemon Puzzle League and Pokemon Snap on there.

From Rare, I'd most like to see Banjo-Kazooie, Conker's Bad Fur Day, Blast Corps, Diddy Kong Racing and Perfect Dark.

From third-parties, I'd really enjoy Ridge Racer 64, ISS 64, Snowboard Kids 2, Resident Evil 2, Beetle Adventure Racing, Space Station Silicon Valley, Mystical Ninja Starring Goemon, NBA Hangtime and WWF No Mercy.

...thirty-three games there...I can dream!

Great list and there's a few in there I haven't actually played before so I'd be happy with that as well.

TCK wrote:

ISS 64, Beetle Adventure Racing, NBA Hangtime and WWF No Mercy.

The only real license issues I can see would be with these games as well.

I reckon you take those 33 games then take away the games from RARE and the licenced titles (I would think Res Evil 2 as well due to the remake) and you've basically got the lineup part from maybe Majoras Mask being missing still it's a solid 25 or so games.

I did see this mock-up Xbox Classic line up


Get rid of NFL 2K5, put in Crismon Skies and that's a banging line up.

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I've gone and looked at the Top 20 PS2 games on Metacritic as you know I'm not a big PS2 fan but I was trying to work out what might be on a PS2 Classic

Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 3
Grand Theft Auto III
Resident Evil 4
Metal Gear Solid 2
Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas
Grand Theft Auto: Vice City
Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec
Madden NFL 2003
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 4
Devil May Cry
Madden NFL 2002
Madden NFL 2004
Metal Gear Solid 3
NCAA Football 2004
God of War
Virtua Fighter 4
Burnout 3: Takedown
God of War II
SSX
SSX 3

That's a pretty awful Top 20 but the user Top 20 is miles better

Dark Cloud 2
Kingdom Hearts II
Ratchet & Clank Up Your Arsenal
Okami
Shadow of the Colossus
Resident Evil 4
Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas
Metal Gear Solid 3
Burnout 3
Final Fantasy X
Klonoa 2
Ratchet & Clank: Going Commando
Silent Hill 2
Sly 2: Band of Thieves
Devil May Cry 3
Metal Gear Solid 2
Bully
Kingdom Hearts
Onimusha 2
TOCA Race Driver 2: The Ultimate Racing Simulator

Now that 20 would get me to buy a PS2 Classic

Gamecube for me, but I can't see that happening. Too much mileage in just HD-ing them up and rereleasing them on modern consoles.

The N64 had its time when I was a kid, but I'd only really want to play Paper Mario and maybe the Banjos again, I think.

The Cappuccino Kid wrote:

Off the top of my head...


I'd very much hope to see Super Mario 64, The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time and GoldenEye 007 on an N64 Classic, as they're the three games most synonymous with the N64. The first two are inevitable, but GoldenEye probably can't be helped.



For first party games, I'd appreciate having Mario Kart 64, Super Smash Bros., Wave Race 64, F-Zero X, Kirby 64, Yoshi's Story, 1080 Snowboarding, Lylat Wars, Sin & Punishment, Mario Party 3, Mario Tennis, Mario Golf, Paper Mario, Pilotwings 64, Pokemon Puzzle League and Pokemon Snap on there.

From Rare, I'd most like to see Banjo-Kazooie, Conker's Bad Fur Day, Blast Corps, Diddy Kong Racing and Perfect Dark.

From third-parties, I'd really enjoy Ridge Racer 64, ISS 64, Snowboard Kids 2, Resident Evil 2, Beetle Adventure Racing, Space Station Silicon Valley, Mystical Ninja Starring Goemon, NBA Hangtime and WWF No Mercy.

...thirty-three games there...I can dream!

I was going to answer this, but the man Kappa's got it. With Majora's Mask and The New Tetris. And GASP! (Not GASP).